Million Dollar Traders
Posted on January 13, 2009 by Richard Beddard
Filed Under Ramblings |
I’d rather be an Apprentice
Did you see Million Dollar Traders? It’s the BBC’s share trading version of The Apprentice, which started last night on BBC 2 at 9.00pm, and continues for another two shows. It’s also on the rather brilliant iPlayer for the next twenty days.
Hedge fund manager Lex van Dam funds eight novices, including (from memory) an environmentalist, a retired IT consultant, a vet, a student and an ex-army Major. They get a crash-course in trading, a trading room, and a mentor who needs to get out more. He’s had lunch outside the office only twice in three years, he tells his lacksidasical team, such are the pressures of life as a trader.
The aim is to see whether they can beat the pros, and win themselves a bonus. The mentor is steadily more pissed off as his fledgling traders freeze under the pressure or bet on successful rights issues at HBOS and recovery at Bradford and Bingley. Meanwhile his boss menaces him down the telephone. It looks like it’s going to be a disaster, and it might just be one, when the novices start putting big bets on.
But even before the programme started, as the BBC were claiming some kind of first in the build up, I wanted to say it’s all been done before. This is the experiment conducted by Richard Dennis in the 1980’s, to prove a point to a colleague.
Over five years, Dennis’ novices, Turtles, as they are known, were spectacularly successful, but there is a crucial difference. The BBC’s Traders have leapt into a metaphorical swimming pool and in two weeks, we’ll find out which ones had the natural ability to swim, or at least float.
Dennis believed he had a system that he could teach, and his objective was to prove it. The Turtles followed his trend-following rules so slavishly they outdid their Dennis, who was unable to stick to his own rules.
In contrast, one of the Traders’ trainers says there is no one, single way to make money, and, by inference, the novices must have learnt all sorts of strategies. I’m no trader, but expecting them to make profitable trades is a bit like giving a trainee a thermometer, a rain gauge and a weather vane with instructions, and asking her to forecast the weather.
Maybe it’s a ruse, to create a bit of tension, and show us how easily you lose money if you follow your instinct, but if Mr van Dam is serious about keeping his money, he’s going to have to step out of the shadows and instil a bit of discipline in his team.
Anyway, it’s all so last year. I imagine surviving hedge fund traders will be cringing, either at the memory of failing banks and short-selling bans, or at how the show is bringing out all the worst trader stereotypes.
I’d rather be an Apprentice.
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25 Responses to “Million Dollar Traders”
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I liked the programme, I would much prefer to be a trader than an apprentice, the guy is right about the commitment they need it, many people think it is just easy money.
I however think it was rediculus that they just put the people into a room as expected them to be able to trade without giving them any hints. The guy also have tight stoplosses on them of 5%, and can only trade in a very short timeframe most trades can come good if you are willing to wait long enough, unless its HBOS!
It does take some knowledge however to know that all shares tend to go down when there is a rights issue due to tempory oversupply of shares in the market, as a rights issue also increases the size of the company however no increase in earnings to begin with.
Having said that, if I had been there the after the first day of realising quite how out of water I was I would gone and got some books on trading and TA.
By the look of next week there were screens with candlesticks on them so hopefully they have received some guidance.
The math question was soo funny 32 = 2^5, 32*32 = 2^10 = 1024 Easy!
Come on Oolon. You’d prefer to be stuck in room all day with Anton? I’d be climbing out of the window. Respect to your superior maths though
Deos anyone know where the trading floor was setup for the show. I cant find it anywhere. It kooked in one shot like Leadenahall St ?
I think it is either the bit behind DB near the Gallery or around tower 42
I like Anton’s efficient no bs style
He makes good telly. I wouldn’t want to work for him though!
Million Dollar Traders is unrealistic.
I don’t think traders alone would also be doing research into companies as well as doing the trading. There’s usually a team of research analysts who rigorously analyse company balance sheet data, news and other data items who then make suggestions on whether to buy or sell a particular stock.
it’s probably not efficient, but a trader shd be completely on the ball when things happen. at the end of the day, the risk rests with the trader, and he shd be comfortable with every decision he is making
i am curious abt what Anton is up to tho? didn’t they say he retired 2yrs ago at age 27 hving made a million?
F9 - he probably got out before he could lose it
we were based at austin friars.
no my friend singh …as a trader u make ur own research and decisions …it is exactly as shown on the show …except some trading desks have much more sophisticated tools than the one on the show …
I am transfixed by this show, much better than Apprentice. The Vet lady is gorgeous !!
Anyone know how to apply for this? Or do u like just get picked?
i was assuming u’d have to forward an application of some sort or something?
Let me know if anyone has any ideas!
Hello Pipo,i believe i heard Ahmed does the trading on his Shop PC/home computer,Does anyone know how to start trading or get the rights on an individual basis coz i’m actually interested?
the final episode was the best. respect to Anton.
Really enjoyed the programme, classic ‘will she cry’ comic moment, priceless. Would have preferred to have seen some real traders lined up to comment and provide contrast to the amateurs generalised laid back niceness and Little House on the Prairie zeal. good stuff though. Anton’s accent, where?
It was entertaining, but what did we actually learn? I still don’t know why they made any of those trades i.e. what they were thinking, whether there was any system to it, or were they just lucky/unlucky?
Hi Guys,
Yep I also really enjoyed the series of three programmes. It was a useful insight into the workings of a hedge fund & how 8 fairly ordinary people could cope (or not) with the basics of learning to trade. I certainly thought the feelings of stress were real.
What I would now like to see is a follow-up programme of fairly detailed analysis of their initial training (of which we saw little of the specifics). I would also like to see each & every one of their trades, the opening & closing prices, & most importantly why they chose that particular stock to trade.
What I obviously want is to learn from their experience rather than just see the generalities & the emotions portrayed.
Great programmes though & I would definitely apply if I ever saw any advertisement to do another series. What a wonderful experience - priceless.
Best regards to all - JohnnyK.
jboy
Anton’s accent is pure scouse, slightly refined - South Liverpool I’d say. Recognized it immediately episode 1, being a native. He’s got a website antonkreil.com. Have a look - up his own fundament or what? Lex & Anton did themselves no favours in allowing the post sacking of Cleo conversation to go out - Emile was right, but I was sure that at one stage things were going to get violent. Best reality TV ever.
i think the biggest mistake is that they forgot to teach the notion of fiduciary duty in that 2-wk crash course - how can ppl walk out just like that with no explanation while losing money? absolutely ridiculous!
If you’re still interested, here’s Anton’s bio
http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2009/01/22/51518/anton-kreil-the-biography/
pretty impressive!
Good production values,editing and “fly on the wall” camera techniques worked really well, from the production team and director/producer. But dear Jesus, what an insight to the “hedge fund manager mentality”and the evil,despotic almost “Nazi”, way those managers guys conduct their daily business. No wonder we are in such a awful state we are in today…watch them integrate and dehumanize Clio! And .that was them being nice to the camera. God help us all! Moral capitalism indeed …too little too late. CJ
One of mates texted me the other night about this show because we met Anton in SE Asia late 2007 (we were doing the same Round The World thingy), it was obvious that he had a few bob but we weren’t sure if he was full of BS with his tales of excess, etc. I spent a couple of hours chatting with him in the back of a bus in Vietnam and must admit he came across as a genuine nice guy, funny, very self assured, and full of confidence. Some good stories too which I won’t get into
Its been a bit surreal watching the show and seeing him at work, but hey, I wish him every success, he’s hungry for success and fair play to him!
One thing kept bugging me all the way through.
Everyone had an excess of technology on their desks but the trades were not actually done on computers.
Was the way they physically made their trades in the program realistic?
I mean phoning up a broker and not clicking “buy” or “sell” on a web page?
And what was that paper in machine - ching! after every transaction?
Anton Kreil’s slight Liverpool accent is GORGEOUS. He has a very attractive way of speaking too. (And this comment doesn’t come from a Scouser!)
What hedge software did they use on Million Dollar Trader